Hebrews 12:11 (NIV) “No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.”

**Transcription Below**

Sue Heimer is an author, Biblical Counselor, Bible teacher and international speaker. She is a sought after conference and retreat speaker inspiring thousands of women each year with her messages of hope. Sue recently authored When You Feel Like Screaming: Practical Help for Frustrated Moms, is the contributor to multiple books including What I Wish I Had Known, and is a regularly featured writer for Focus on the Family and Faith Life publications. Her greatest blessing and joy is being a wife to Curt, for over 30 years, and mom to four adult sons who, along with their spouses, continue to add grandchildren to their lives.

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Gospel Scripture: (all NIV)

Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”

Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”

Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.”

Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”

Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.”

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”

Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”

Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”

Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus”

Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession- to the praise of his glory.”

Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.”

Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“

Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“

Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”

**Transcription**

[00:00:00] <music>

Laura Dugger: Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here.

[00:00:17] <music>

Laura Dugger: Today's message is brought to you by Chick-fil-A East Peoria. Stay tuned for insider tips we're going to share during the episode.

Sue Heimer is our guest today. She is married to Curt and they raised four children. She is an author and speaker and this episode is full of practical solutions to help make your life a little bit easier as a mom. We are going to learn more of her heart behind her book titled When You Feel Like Screaming: Practical Help for Frustrated Moms. I hope you find this chat to be helpful.

Hello, Sue. Welcome to The Savvy Sauce.

Sue Heimer: Good morning to you. Thank you for inviting me.

Laura Dugger: Will you begin by telling us more about your motherhood journey?

Sue Heimer: I absolutely will. I'll begin by saying it was harder than anticipated. My most difficult years... I have four adult sons now, and the most difficult time for me, I was just reminded yesterday again when I was around one of my grandsons, that 12-month to two-year-old stage was the hardest for me as a mom because they were mobile but I could not reason with them. That was very difficult.[00:01:35]

Then I came up for air and had some really great preschool and grade school years and then the teen years hit. And those were also very challenging for me.

But probably in my parenting journey, for my husband and I, both, we were very intentional. I mean, he was great about keeping our me on track with this and reminding me of this because, you know, I was boots to the ground every day with the kids, whether I was home full-time or working part-time or whatever it was.

He just reminded me, let's be real intentional to purpose to enjoy every stage and season of life to the fullest of our children and not wish them away. And I'll tell you lots of times, Laura, that was a choice, not a feeling. But when I chose to say, "I will enjoy this time in their lives," those feelings caught up. And I really enjoyed my children because I dived in with both feet and said, just like the teen years, this is going to go away. This isn't forever. And even though it might be really hard and difficult, there's so much blessing in this season, so let's embrace it, whatever that means for our family. [00:02:45]

I think for moms, just to know someone's actually admitting it's harder than they thought. It's hard and there's a tremendous blessing in it. But I wish someone would have come alongside me and put their arm around me and said, You're not alone. This can be really hard sometime and full of blessing. Because I felt guilty a lot of times when I thought, does anyone else realize how difficult this is being a mom?

My motherhood journey had seasons to it. It changes with the stages of your children's lives. And it looked very different at different times.

Laura Dugger: In your book, you say 298 of the 300 women surveyed used different language, but all admitted to either yelling or screaming at their kids. So if a listener is hearing this today and they identify that they're not alone in this struggle, where can they go from here?

Sue Heimer: Great question. For me, a game changer for moms is when you identify what's putting you over the edge. [00:03:48] Because when you identify your triggers, that's empowering because then you can implement change.

Now, I'm going to be honest with you, when I lost it with my kids, I certainly didn't want to go write a journal about it. I just wanted to move on with my day because mostly I felt guilt after I would lose it with my kids. But here's the deal. If you as a mom would just take a moment, even if it's on the backside of the envelope, and write down, okay, I just lost, I just yelled, raised my voice. Write down what had just transpired. And do that for a week and look at that and say, Do I see a pattern? Because if you can see what your triggers are, then you're going to be able to make some change.

So what makes you lose your indoor mommy voice? Is it that time when you do really good all day? And it's what I call the piranha hour. It's between when they get home from school and supper time, those piranha hours in there where they're hungry, they're tired. [00:04:47]

Well, if you lose it every day around 5:00, 5:15 because everyone's waiting for your spouse to come home to eat, maybe you just change it up and say to your spouse, "Honey, every day we're going to have supper at 5.15 and we'd love for you to be here, but if you're not, I'm going to feed the kids and we'll enjoy a snack with you when you get home and we can sit around while you eat supper and have our evening snack. But this has to change because I'm flipping out. You come home, I'm stressed, the kids are stressed from me losing it." That is a game changer because you're giving yourself, empowering yourself to make some changes.

Or maybe it's the mom who she does great but every day you know she walks across the floor and there's lucky charms stuck to the bottom of her socks, you know? And she's just like, her floors drive her crazy. She's identified what is a trigger that puts her over the edge.

Well, empowered with that, maybe you hire a high school girl to come in once a week or twice a week at four o'clock and you hand her a sweeper and she sweeps your entire house. And you pay her so much, whatever you've agreed upon. But then that's one trigger that you've taken care of. [00:06:03]

Or maybe your trigger is your high school daughter's room, and it's just a constant battle because it looks like a pigsty and you are arguing over that on a daily basis. Maybe that's one where that trigger... you just need to walk away. There's no shame in leaving the battlefield and let things de-escalate.

You may just have to shut that bedroom door and walk away from it. And if she chooses to live in squalor, you may have to let her and just say, "Honey, if you want your laundry done, you bring your clothes out and do your laundry yourself. If you don't know how to do it I will show you how to use the washer and dryer but that door remains closed." And that's not a trigger for you, mom setting you over the edge, and then not only does that affect your daughter, but a ripple effects to your relationship with your spouse, your relationship with your other children.

Laura Dugger: That's great because it also gives all of us ownership over our own actions. That ties into another topic that you address in your book. And that is healthy boundaries. So how can we place those healthy boundaries around ourselves instead of over-committing to everything during every season? [00:07:13]

Sue Heimer: You know, on my website at SueHeimer.com, I have a free download under "resources". In it says this, seven questions to ask before adding anything to your schedule. I have moms, grandmas, they print these out and they put them on their fridge. I still use this. I have an actual physical day planner and it's taped inside my day planner. Because this puts boundaries in my life and helps me say no.

Questions like, will this benefit me or my family in a positive way? If I'm adding something to my schedule, I've got to ask that. Or do I even have a passion for this commitment? I have said yes over the years out of guilt when I had no passion for it nor felt called to be involved in it.

Is my schedule already full? Laura, if my schedule is already full, what am I going to admit from my schedule to take on a new responsibility? No, you can't omit the kids. So it's got to be something that has to go so you can make room and create space to bring this on. [00:08:17]

But for me, especially during the years when I had young children, the question that got me every time was, is this an absolutely necessary obligation at this season of my life? That was huge for me. Because maybe it wasn't the season, the time right then. And then ask your husband and children what they think of this commitment. Ask them. I mean, they're going to have an opinion, and that may help you sort out if this is the time.

I'm a firm believer, Laura, that our greatest ministry is our own families. I don't believe we should be taking pot roast carrots and potatoes to the neighbor down the street when our children are home eating SpaghettiOs.

Laura Dugger: That's a really practical example. Do you have any other examples that people could grab on to?

Sue Heimer: I just remember when I first started my speaking career and I started traveling. I really limited how often I would leave my family because I didn't want to miss anything. I didn't want to miss the Friday night football games and the after-school stories that they tell me about their day. [00:09:28]

One particular day, the day before, I had gotten a call from a national women's group who asked me to join their speaker team, and that would mean a lot more travel as a Christian speaker. And my husband and I had agreed to pray about it for a couple weeks and see if this is a door opening or just how we should proceed with this invitation.

That very next day, my bag was by the back door and my son Brock, he was in eighth grade at the time. He came in the sunroom and looked at my bag sitting there and he goes, "So are you speaking today?" And I said, "Yeah, I'm speaking up in Chicago." He finally said, "So will you be here when I get home?"

And that was my answer. I didn't have to pray about this invitation for a few weeks. I knew right now the answer for me was no. Don't take on any more than you already have on your plate. Because what my son was saying is, "Will you physically be here for me?" He's not impressed. [00:10:27]

Your children aren't impressed if you're president of the PTA, or you're on the school board, or you're traveling the country speaking at women's conferences. What they want to know is, will you be here for me? That doesn't mean that you can't do those other things. But to keep them in balance, keep boundaries in your life so you have time for your family.

Laura Dugger: You also share some practical tips for communicating openly and honestly with our children. Can you just share a few of those tips and teach us how it prepares them to become future adults?

Sue Heimer: Yeah. Communication is huge. And you're exactly right, preparing them to be adult and be good communicators. I'm a firm believer in age-appropriate communication with your kids. So what does that look like? You may have to get down on your knees in front of your preschooler and take her little face in your hands and just say, "You know, mommy is sad today and her sad is kind of turning to mad. So she's gonna put herself in timeout for a little bit." [00:11:30]

You've just communicated to your preschooler that mommy's having a tough day because her sad's turning to mad and she needs to step into her bedroom and just take a few minutes, hit the pause button, redirect, let whatever emotions she has going on just settle down a little bit so she can come back out and deal with whatever the situation is.

Not only did she communicate with her daughter, but her daughter just seen modeled to her anger management through that communication. Or maybe it's those teens. It's a tough season in your life. Maybe you have a sick aging parent and you sit them all down around the table and you say, "You know, we're going through a very difficult season right now. Grandma fell. She broke her hip. She's in the hospital. I need to be there for her and it's going to get better. This journey isn't going to last forever, but right now we need the whole family to step up and help and maybe do some chores that you haven't had to do in the past. But we need you. Can we count on you to be there for us?" [00:12:36]

You've just communicated to those teens. And those teens are going to rise to the challenge because they feel honored you've shared that with them and they're going to want to be a team player in that.

Laura Dugger: What age do you recommend starting this style of communication? What age should our children be?

Sue Heimer: I remember as a young mom, I was leaving a grocery store and I just had my oldest son, Seth, and he was two at the time. And an elderly lady stopped me in the parking lot and she said, "I just want to tell you, I watched you back there in the grocery store and your son was getting really upset and you got right down, right eye level to him and you told him, 'Your behavior is not appropriate. Mom's gonna have to take you out to the vehicle and we're gonna have to leave this store.'"

And I set some boundaries right there and verbally communicated with him how I was feeling, what the expectation was, and what the consequence was gonna have to be. And she just said, "I loved how you talked to him like he was understanding what you were saying." And I said, "He may not be able to verbally talk back to me clearly right now and express how he feels, but he understands what I'm saying." [00:13:54]

Laura Dugger: And I think that just communicates a high level of respect for our children, even if we start when they are that young. I love that you include a section in your book on sleep, especially because it's a book for moms. Will you tell us more about your findings of sleep deprivation?

Sue Heimer: Absolutely. This was very eye-opening for me when I started to study sleep deprivation. Because as a young mom, I remember In church one day a lady came up to me and she looked at me and she said... we were just having a sweet conversation and she finally said, "Oh, you're such a busy mom. You need a hobby." And I looked at her and I said, "Okay, I choose sleep. Does sleep count?"

Because I was so exhausted. I would wake up in the morning and literally my first thought many days was, "What time can I get to bed tonight?" Because I just lived in exhaustion all the time. So with my study, I really dived into this. And I found out even the American Medical Association tells us that you are 15% to 20% more likely to be clinically depressed when you consistently lack sleep. [00:15:02]

Protecting your sleep should be huge. Sleep is underrated and moms need their sleep. Whatever you need to do. For us, we tag-teamed when the kids were babies. I would feed that little baby about 8 o'clock and then I would go right to bed. And my husband would give the infant a bottle at 11. And then I would then get up three hours after that, two, three in the morning, whatever that looked like. And by the time I got up for that first feeding from eight to two, I had five hours of respite. But just learning what that looks like when they were even toddlers or preschoolers, tag teaming as much as possible to get sleep.

This even went on for me in the teen years, because I realized why it was so important that I needed to get sleep. Definitely, my lack of sleep carried over into my functioning as a mom the next day. When I was exhausted, I definitely lost my indoor mommy voice on a more consistent basis. [00:16:03] But when I was rested, I was able to stay cool and calm and collected under some really pressure-filled moments.

So even when we had teens, we invested in these little white noise machines. I put one in our bedroom, I put one in their bedrooms, because as a teen mom, I could hear them walking through the home, or if it was the weekend, being nocturnal in the middle of the night, and walking out to the fridge, or sitting in the living room. Whatever it was, I did everything I could to protect my sleep so I could be a better mom.

Laura Dugger: I love that you mentioned the word respite there. So as it relates to soul care, what are some signals that we're not getting enough respite?

Sue Heimer: When you're on edge, when you have tension headaches, when you find yourself raising your voice a lot, when you answer your children with really short answers, those are all signs that you need a break, you need a hiding place. [00:17:04]

It took years for me to realize there's no guilt in respite. There shouldn't be guilt in respite. I always felt guilty when I took a few moments to myself, but I encourage every mom I encounter, create a hiding place. Moms need a hiding place and they need intentional respite.

I often think about how many times in scripture where our Lord Jesus Christ and His disciples got in the boat and went out into the lake to escape the crowds. And they knew right where those crowds were. They were running along the shore of the lake following them. But they went out in the middle of the lake. Why? To take a break.

I think if the Lord Jesus Christ, our Savior, modeled to us that we need a break, His disciples, He modeled to his disciples the importance of respite, why should we feel guilty when we take time and step away? And that hiding place is gonna look very different from you than your best friends.

For years, my hiding place was literally I kept a one-pound bag of M&M's hidden behind some purses in my walk-in closet. [00:18:12] And when it got too much during the day, I stepped away. I went in my master bedroom, I shut the door. I went into my walk-in closet, I shut the door. And I reached up there and I got a few M&M's and I sat on the floor of my closet and I just ate some M&Ms.

I was in there maybe five minutes, but those five minutes hit the pause button, gave me a break. And I knew exactly where my children were. They were beating on the door outside the master bedroom saying, "Mommy, Mommy, are you in there?" And sticking their fingers under the door. I knew exactly where they were. They were totally safe. That I as a mom had created a hiding place, my sanctuary, for just a few minutes for me.

As a mom, I encourage moms, grandmas, aunts, they need to get creative with this. Maybe for you, you have the luxury of escaping every Saturday morning while your spouse is home from 9 to 10 to walk through a bookstore with a hot coffee in your hand or you go to a coffee shop. [00:19:13] Maybe you can get away for a weekend night once in a while.

I have a friend, Veronica, she's a single mom, she has three beautiful sons, and she's a full-time working mom. And I said, "Veronica, how do you find a hiding place?" And she said, I have to get very creative. But she said, "Three days a week, I arranged with the sitter to pick up my boys a half hour later on those days." And she said, "Three days a week, I pull into a nearby park. And if it's warm out, I walk the park. If it's cool out, I keep a novel in my glove compartment of my car and I sit in my car and I read a couple chapters of that novel."

She said, "That's my hiding place." She said, "It doesn't seem like much, an hour and a half total a week," but she said, "this helps me keep my sanity. This helps me go home refreshed, ready to tackle the evening activities."

Laura Dugger: Let's take a quick break to hear a message from our sponsor. [00:20:15]

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Laura Dugger: What about on the other side? Are there any signals that we are getting too much respite?

Sue Heimer: Yes, Laura. I think for some moms, the encouragement is they need to come home. That respite has become their idol. We all love an escape. We all love respite. I mean, there's times I would just like, "Oh, just get me out of here." That's good. You need to own that, feel that, and get out and do something different.

But if your children are starting to act out, if your teens are saying, "Mom, you're never around when we're home, where are you?" There's got to be some balance because your kids need you.

Laura Dugger: And we all have heard so many times that consistency is important, but it can really feel exhausting to follow through. So you've mentioned some systems that work for you. Can you share some ideas for us for how to be consistent? [00:22:16]

Sue Heimer: One game changer for my husband and I with our four sons was early on in our parenting years, we introduced the timer. Now, we used kitchen timers. We bought three of them because they will hide them on you. Your children will. But a mom can use it just even on her phone, a timer. And for us, this really put the responsibility back on our children.

Before the timer, I would say to the children, "Clean up this living room. You have 10 minutes to clean up this mess." And my kids would ignore me because in their mind, she doesn't mean it yet. Her voice isn't raised. She doesn't mean it. And they would just continue playing.

Three minutes later, I'd walk back to the living room and I'd raise my voice a little more: "Clean up this mess. I told you guys to get cleaning." They'd kind of look at me. And then a few minutes later, I come in and I totally lose it. "Clean up the mess!" And they're like, "Now she means it." Because I had trained my sons very well. "You don't have to respond. You don't have to obey until mom loses it and then you can obey." [00:23:21] That means that it's time to make this happen. So we introduced the timer.

If you have younger children and you introduce the timer, I'm going to encourage you to walk this through with them a few times. The older children can be verbally instructed. But for instance, when my Casey was three years old, I would say, "Casey, we're going to clean up the living room. So mommy's going to set the timer for 10 minutes and we have 10 minutes to get this living room all cleaned up. If we don't get it cleaned up in 10 minutes, we gotta go sit in the corner for three minutes and then we'll come back and try to get it cleaned up again."

I encourage moms to fail the first couple times. So I would take Casey by the hand, we'd set the timer, I'd go into the living room with him and we'd start picking up and cleaning up the living room, and all of a sudden the timer would go off and I'd go, "Oh Casey, we didn't get the living room picked up." So we would go and we'd sit in the corner together and I'd turn the timer to three minutes and after three minutes I'd say, "Okay, we're gonna set the timer for ten minutes again. Let's try it again." [00:24:22]

By day number three, I'm walking this through with him a few times. I didn't have to walk it through anymore with him. I set the timer, I said, "Casey, it's time to clean up the living room." One time the timer went off and the living room wasn't clean and Casey turned to me and he says, "I know, I know, I'll be in the corner." And off they would go.

For older children, this was a game changer for our family. For instance, we would set the timer at night, and we'd say, "Okay, everyone, 20 minutes before bed." Now, this has to be age-appropriate. So the younger ones, the 4 and 5-year-olds, would know 20 minutes till bedtime means they needed to brush their teeth, get their pajamas on, and be in bed and ready for a goodnight prayer and a story.

For the older children, and you may have to post this on your fridge, this meant book bags by the back door, lunch packed for the next day, shoes by the back door, your clothes laid out for the next day, and you cannot change your mind. What you laid out the night before is what you're wearing the next day. [00:25:23] And then teeth brushed, you know, pajamas on, in bed, waiting for prayers and a good night.

We would set that timer. And when the timer went off... and I will inject here, while the timer is ticking, do not say, "10 minutes, you got eight minutes," but they're not doing anything. Ignore it. This is about putting the responsibility back on the child. So mom, dad, you say nothing. Let that timer run down.

So the expectation was they were in bed ready for that prayer and story if they were younger. If that wasn't done, that was expectation wasn't done, the consequence was you have to go to bed 15 minutes earlier the next night. We would say, "You know what? We appreciate your effort but tomorrow, bedtime starts 15 minutes earlier." And if the next night they don't do it, bedtime starts 15 minutes earlier.

If you have a rebellious child, let me tell you, he's going to be going to bed right after supper, which isn't such a bad thing sometimes. But they will get it because you put the responsibility back on the child. Use that same routine in the morning.

Someone asked me, a tween and teenager, are they too old for a timer? I said, "If your child is still struggling accomplishing tasks, they are not too old for a timer." [00:26:38] I have some friends that I've met over the years that they are still calling their college student away at college to tell him it's time to get up so he makes it in time for class. That is not okay.

If you're still waking your teenager, that is not okay, because you are raising someone's future employee, and employer, and neighbor, and friend, and spouse, and you should not still be waking that child up.

So, in the morning... Let's go back. In the morning, we would set the timer and say, "Okay, everybody, time to get up, and you have 20 minutes to brush your teeth, get dressed, and whatever your routine is, and be in the kitchen." When that timer went off, if they weren't in the kitchen, the consequence was for younger kids, they didn't get an after-school snack, and for the older kids, they got assigned an extra chore. You need to make it matter.

Laura Dugger: What you're saying reminds me of Hebrews 12:11, and it says, "No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it." And I think those are great ideas of what you shared of how to live that scripture out. Will you also elaborate on your creative twist to the typical chore chart? [00:27:51]

Sue Heimer: Yes, Laura. We got very creative with our sons. And I got five mason jars. They were just pint size and I put them in the cupboard, one for each boy and then one for me, mom. And every week I would stack in front of each of the boy's jars 10 $1 bills. Those 10 $1 bills was their allowance at the end of the week.

Now, moms don't panic because some of you are saying, "I don't have $40 a week to give my kids." Trust me when you hear this, you're going to earn most of that back. So what it looked like was we put a list of chores on the fridge or you put it inside a cupboard and each son knew exactly what his responsibility was every day. Might be before and after school, depending on the situation.

But for instance, Seth may come home from school, and on Monday he is to feed and water the dog, empty the dishwasher, wipe down the cupboards, and clean a bathroom. At the bottom of the chore chart for all the boys it will state all chores must be finished by 4:45. [00:28:56] Your family the time might be different.

So what this would look like on Monday is at 4:45 I would go over to the chore chart and I would say, "Seth, did you get all this accomplished?" And he may say, "Oh, no, no, no, I forgot to empty the dishwasher. I'll get it right now." And I'll say, "No, it's 4.45." And I would turn to his brothers, Levi, Casey, or Brock, and I would say, "Seth didn't empty the dishwasher. Does anyone want to empty the dishwasher for Seth and earn two of his dollars?"

Now, my boys were incredibly competitive. And let me tell you they love nothing more than taking money from their brothers. Casey's like, "Yes, yes, I'll do it." So I would take $2 off of Seth's pile and I would put it in Casey's pint mason jar. And Casey just earned $2 from his brother.

And if there was nobody around, and it was just Seth and I home, or if none of the brothers wanted to do Seth's chores, I would have to do it. But mom is double, because my time is very valuable. So I would go over and I would take $4 off of Seth's pile, I would put it in my jar, and I would go and empty the dishwasher. [00:30:03]

This created such a peace in our home. After school time became so much more pleasant as a family because I wasn't constantly saying, "Did you do your chores? Did you do your chores? Look at the time." I said nothing after school. I knew at 4:45, I would address any unfinished chores. But chores started to get done because those boys hated paying each other. I love that.

Laura Dugger: After years of intentional parenting, now what are some character qualities that you see in your sons?

Sue Heimer: That is a great question, Laura. We always kept in the forefront of our mind that we are raising someone's future spouse, employer, employee, neighbor, or friend. So the character qualities I see now in our boys, they're very responsible, they're hardworking. They're devoted to their families. They have a great sense of empathy for others. And I think that may have come from the communication pattern that we started with the boys of telling them, "Hey, mom's having a bad day or dad's having a rough week." That created empathy in them for us as parents, for their brothers. And we've seen it now played out in their co-workers, friends and neighbors, that the boys are diligent.

They're hospitable. They open their homes. I don't know if that's because during the teen years we had teens in our house so often or it's because we invited other families over for meals. And it wasn't always convenient, but we just wanted to model it for our sons. [00:31:34] But they certainly caught that because they're very hospitable.

They're very generous with their time with others. Your children watch you. I tell you what, Kurt and I fell flat on our face so many times in parenting, where we were so thankful we had 365 days a year to parent our kids. The good Lord did that on purpose because he knew we were going to fail many, many, many of those days. And we could do a whole podcast on how we failed as parents and what we learned through those failures.

and our four sons are very different from each other. They're not clones of each other. But it is wonderful to see them now as adults with some really wonderful character qualities, despite our failures as parents.

Laura Dugger: Well, and as you think back on those many years of really involved parenting, what are a few things specifically that you're so glad you and Curt did?

Sue Heimer: I think probably one of the number one things in parenting is through the teen years and because of the age span of our boys, the first three are close in age and then there's five five-year difference between the third and fourth son. [00:32:41] But all through those years… So it ended up being nine years straight, every Friday night we would invite any of the high schoolers over to our house after football games and after basketball games.

We would get up to 70 kids. That doesn't mean you have to host 70 kids. Maybe you just have their closest friends or a smaller gathering. But we went through that seven questions to ask before adding anything to our schedule. We put hosting high schoolers at our house through those questions. And we knew it was the season of our life to do it. We knew what our kids would think of that commitment. And we knew that this would really allow us to be able to be used by God.

That was one thing we are so thankful we did. I served the same thing every week when they'd all come over. We did nacho bar. But you know, to this day, we still run into those teens that were in our home. We still have connections with those teens. [00:33:41]

But our boys learned to work together as a family, to set up for the kids to come over, to tear down when the kids left. They worked as a family to get everything done early in the week so we could plan for that. And it taught our kids to be hospitable.

Laura Dugger: I love that tradition. That's incredible to hear that all of that investment has really paid off. Our listeners are some of the kindest people we've met. Your gracious comments through social media, email, and our website fuel us to continue producing more content.

Some of you have asked what you can do to support The Savvy Sauce. As you know, we greatly appreciate it when you share episodes with friends. Now, for as little as $2 a month, there is a new way to financially show your support. These contributions, ranging from $2 to $20 per month, will be rewarded with extra podcasts, free downloadable scripture cards, and more.

Check out all the details at thesavvysauce.com and click on our "Patreon" tab to find out how you can be a supporter of the arts. Thanks for participating. [00:34:46]

Sue, this has just been such a joy. If listeners want to connect with you further, where can they find you?

Sue Heimer: They can find me on my website at sueheimer.com and that is where there are some free resources under the resource tab. But they can also find me on Facebook @SueHeimer.

Laura Dugger: We will definitely link to all of that, as always, in our show notes. You may know we're called The Savvy Sauce because "savvy" is synonymous with practical knowledge, and we want to know how to apply some beneficial best practices from your life. So as my final question for you today, Sue, what is your savvy sauce?

Sue Heimer: My Savvy Sauce for today would be set your alarm 15 minutes earlier each morning to leave room for emergencies or disruption in your routine. It doesn't matter if you have toddlers, teens, or your kids are out of the home. Most days, there is an eruption of some sort. And if it doesn't happen, you've just earned 15 minutes of white space in your day, and that is a gift. [00:35:51]

Laura Dugger: What a great idea. Sue, you have parented so well. Thank you for sharing your journey with us and all of these practical tips. Really enjoyed our time together today.

Sue Heimer: Thank you, Laura. It was an honor to join you.

Laura Dugger: One more thing before you go. Have you heard the term "gospel" before? It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you. But it starts with the bad news. Every single one of us were born sinners and God is perfect and holy, so He cannot be in the presence of sin. Therefore, we're separated from Him.

This means there's absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So for you and for me, it means we deserve death and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved. We need a savior. But God loved us so much, He made a way for His only Son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute.

This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with Him. [00:36:53] That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life we could never live and died in our place for our sin. This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus.

We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished if we choose to receive what He has done for us. Romans 10:9 says that if you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

So would you pray with me now? Heavenly, Father, thank You for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to You. Will You clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare You as Lord of their life? We trust You to work and change their lives now for eternity. In Jesus name, we pray, amen. [00:37:53]

If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring Him for me, so me for Him, you get the opportunity to live your life for Him.

At this podcast, we are called Savvy for a reason. We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So you're ready to get started?

First, tell someone. Say it out loud. Get a Bible. The first day I made this decision my parents took me to Barnes and Noble to get the Quest NIV Bible and I love it. Start by reading the book of John.

Get connected locally, which basically means just tell someone who is part of the church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ. I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you.

We want to celebrate with you too. So feel free to leave a comment for us if you made a decision for Christ. We also have show notes included where you can read Scripture that describes this process. [00:38:53]

Finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, "In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents." The heavens are praising with you for your decision today.

If you've already received this good news, I pray that you have someone else to share it with today. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.

Welcome to The Savvy Sauce

Practical chats for intentional living

A faith-based podcast and resources to help you grow closer to Jesus and others. Expect encouragement, surprises, and hope here. Each episode offers lively interviews with fascinating guests such as therapists, authors, non-profit founders, and business leaders.

They share their best practices and savvy tips we can replicate to make our daily life and relationships more enjoyable!